Competent persons. Wire installation.


Postby staaue » Fri Dec 04, 2009 8:09 pm

Hello everyone.

I have a question which has been answered in other threads, but I'd like to ask my version of it, it you wouldn't mind.

My mother recently had a new bathroom fitted and a new shower with it. My question is:

Can the builder install the wiring so the electrician can later connect the shower to the mains?

I've queried him about his qualifications and he doesn't appear to be classed as a 'competent person'.

Is he legally allowed to undertake this work?

Thanks in advance.
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Postby ericmark » Sat Dec 05, 2009 12:21 pm

This is a grey area and hard to give a answer. If you consider a normal electrical firm the electricians working for that firm are not registered as such but the firm is and although one or two guys may do the inspecting and testing they all install including the apprentice.

When the firm is short on labour they can hire from many sources including sub contracting so they could on large jobs sub contract the cable pulling for example.

So there are two things with control what they can do. One is the contract they have with the scheme provider for Part P. And second nature of contract between them and builder. The latter would dictate what control they have.

I is likely they did not fully comply with the Part P conditions but the apprentice could have installed the cables so why not the builder?

In many jobs I have worked on a fitter and electrician work in pairs and the fitter labours for electrician and electrician labours for fitter so who's in charge swaps from job to job. And this working together has been encouraged.

If you think the builders work is sub-standard then getting it corrected is of course something that should be done. But if you make waves without cause you could end up without the completion certificate and could be just shooting ones self in the foot.

If the builder had to notify LACB over work done then the LABC could be the one issuing the certificate not the electricians scheme provider. In which case there would be nothing as to Part P to stop the builder doing any electrics.

There is the Electricity at Work Act and general employment law in that people should be trained to do the task but unless you could actually pin point something dangerous which he had done then I would think you would be on thin ice.

Lets face it clipping cable to a beam is not really rocket science.
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Postby moggy1968 » Mon Dec 07, 2009 6:08 pm

who is going to register the work with building control?
this is notifiable work.
the electrician may be happy to let the builder instal the cabling and then to come in to test and certify but as above that depends on the terms of his contract with his registering body.
what you need when the work is done is the installationcertificate with schedule of results or, if no new circuit has been laud a minor works certificate. then you need the documentation from building control to say the work has been registered.
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Postby ericmark » Tue Dec 08, 2009 9:47 am

[quote="moggy1968"]who is going to register the work with building control?
[/quote]
People who are doing building work which needs building control involvement for other parts of the work.
If you were a builder and most of your work goes through LABC and only the odd job does not required LABC then there is no reason you you shouldn't use an electrician would is not part of any scheme. In which case there is nothing stopping the builder from DIY.

I would agree if the electrician is self certifying work then the builder likely should not be doing part of the work himself but one can't say he can't as one has no idea from post on who is issuing the completion certificate.

If we say the builder can't do work and the poster of this question takes that as gospel and tattles the builder who has used LABC as least he would be embarrassed and he could get in hot water. So we must be honest and say the builder may not be breaking any rules and until you get the completion certificate it is impossible to prove either way.
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