Opinion on directing to projects section.


Postby ericmark » Mon Sep 01, 2008 7:21 am

When I see a post I will read for one of two reasons either to see if I can help or to see how others have answered and add to my knowledge. If busy I will only read unanswered messages. When I read the message then one of four actions will normally result.
1) Answer straight away.
2) Leave for time being while I consider how to answer.
3) Ask for further information.
4) Not something I can help with, so I leave altogether.
Although as part of the answer I may refer someone to the projects section I can’t see how answering by solely referring to this section can help as:-
1) It reduces the chance of anyone else reading and helping.
2) If the project was likely to have been understood, then the person posting would have likely to have read anyway.
Although the projects section is good, it is very general, and I have seen some questions asked where the projects section will not help. Yet I still see a post recommending they read this section with no other help offered. This does not help person posting and reduces chance of them getting help from others. I do wonder if the person recommending the projects section has ever read it?

For example the project on kitchen lighting, lighting circuits, lights in kitchen units, low voltage lighting, replace a light fitting, wiring a ceiling rose, wiring in wall lights, and light bulbs blowing there is nothing on two way lighting, and yet one still sees posts recommending the person reads these when they have a problem wiring two way lamps.
The person giving advice has clearly not read projects section themselves. However lights and switches, lighting circuits and replace light fitting all help wiring a ceiling rose the latter being very good.
Even then surely a few guidance words are required like:- The fixed wirings reds/browns normally connect together, but do not connect to pendent lamp, look at lights and switches, lighting circuits and replace light fitting.
This would be much more helpful to just look at projects section? It would be better to say nothing than that? and then someone else may read and help. Anyway that’s my opinion.
If after 24 hours no one has answered then maybe refer to projects but only if it does contain help.
Am I wrong? Maybe others do it different but I read unanswered posts first. Once answered even if answer is rubbish the likely hood of other answers is reduced.
Opinions please.

Eric
ericmark

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Postby BLAKEY1963 » Mon Sep 01, 2008 9:22 am

[quote="ericmark"]When I see a post I will read for one of two reasons either to see if I can help or to see how others have answered and add to my knowledge. If busy I will only read unanswered messages. When I read the message then one of four actions will normally result.
1) Answer straight away.
2) Leave for time being while I consider how to answer.
3) Ask for further information.
4) Not something I can help with, so I leave altogether.
Although as part of the answer I may refer someone to the projects section I can’t see how answering by solely referring to this section can help as:-
1) It reduces the chance of anyone else reading and helping.
2) If the project was likely to have been understood, then the person posting would have likely to have read anyway.
Although the projects section is good, it is very general, and I have seen some questions asked where the projects section will not help. Yet I still see a post recommending they read this section with no other help offered. This does not help person posting and reduces chance of them getting help from others. I do wonder if the person recommending the projects section has ever read it?

For example the project on kitchen lighting, lighting circuits, lights in kitchen units, low voltage lighting, replace a light fitting, wiring a ceiling rose, wiring in wall lights, and light bulbs blowing there is nothing on two way lighting, and yet one still sees posts recommending the person reads these when they have a problem wiring two way lamps.
The person giving advice has clearly not read projects section themselves. However lights and switches, lighting circuits and replace light fitting all help wiring a ceiling rose the latter being very good.
Even then surely a few guidance words are required like:- The fixed wirings reds/browns normally connect together, but do not connect to pendent lamp, look at lights and switches, lighting circuits and replace light fitting.
This would be much more helpful to just look at projects section? It would be better to say nothing than that? and then someone else may read and help. Anyway that’s my opinion.
If after 24 hours no one has answered then maybe refer to projects but only if it does contain help.
Am I wrong? Maybe others do it different but I read unanswered posts first. Once answered even if answer is rubbish the likely hood of other answers is reduced.
Opinions please.

Eric[/quote]

ERICMARK
Good morning kind sir hope u r well , its BLAKEY1963.
I have read your post a few times and respect fully
what u have said.
I feel the projects section is an important part of this site
and the infomation in it , is as accurate as it can be at that
time. I know that it is constantly looked at and improved
as time goes on.
Eric as one of the many people on this site who trys to help
others , your input has been imense and worthwhile , but
Like myslef , the advice we give relies upon interpreting
the person who posts a question.
PERSONALLY , i think the safety of the person posting the
question is paramount , and rather than
Mislead , or say nothing an input is required.
If this involves sending to projects first , then
when they come back , and state they have
looked there then further debate on the site
can continue.
I think the advice given , whatever it is
depends on how much knowledge , we
think the person posting has , and as we
know mains voltage can kill very
Effectively so we have to be careful what we
Advise .
To close if we are going to comment we
have to think of thier safety , and if this
Involves , sending to the projects section
First , or getting in an Electrician first , or
Giving practical advice first , because the
Person ( INTERPETING that it is safe
to give the knowledge , because the person
posting displays an understanding of the subject )
will beneifit , then that is what we could do at that
time.


BLAKEY1963
BLAKEY1963
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Postby ericmark » Mon Sep 01, 2008 10:08 pm

OK reading your reply I will have to agree.
But the following post was made and is an example of what I was talking about although not a very good example:-
“Post subject: fluorescent lights
what is the best way to wire fluorescent lights. i have two lights that need to be switched from two switches. could anybody provide any wiring diagrams form consumer unit to lights ad switches?

thanks”
This was a silly post as you can see and one must wonder what the guy expects but on the other hand the reply was as vague and maybe with just cause!

Reply was:- “HAVE A look at project section on lighting circuits”

Looking through the lighting projects there is a real hooch pooch and although some are very good some are also a load of rubbish and to direct to a specific was really required but as to which one I am not sure.
“kitchen lighting” Nothing about wiring only about types of light. Since fluorescents often used in kitchens one would expect something. But more to do with plastering than electrics.

“lighting circuits” Diagrams only show routes too small for anyone to see how each unit is wired.

“Lights and switches” good diagrams but does not really show how it could be adapted to a fluorescent.

“lights in kitchen units” complete waste of time pictures poor and when enhanced not really a good example!

“low voltage lighting” with comments like SELV lights give 2 to 3 times the light of standard bulb and 60% more efficient and referring to 20W and 50W bulbs can’t really recommend that one.

“replace a light fitting” at last a good one and combine with the “lighting circuits” and “lights and switches” gives most of what any normal DIY’er would require but does not cover fluorescents.

“wiring a ceiling rose” again good but needs combining with other three and still nothing about fluorescents.

“wiring in wall lights” Looks like first year apprentice work and shows junction boxes where once completed would be inaccessible so not really a good example.

“light bulbs blowing” nothing about wiring.

So I was not really able to find anything in projects which would have helped him. As to how it should have been answered I don’t know. Maybe “It is unusual to wire back to a consumer unit when adding lamps and how they are wired is really dependent on what access is available and where located. There is some information to be found in projects if this does not help maybe you explain more fully as to what you are trying to do and what you already have?”

But nearly three weeks ago a bit late now. There is need for something on fluorescent lamps and two way and intermediate switching in the projects section but it’s not that which concerned me it was the fact I and all others had skipped this post because it had been answered. I and I would think you do the same look for unanswered posts first and only after they and inspected does one start to look at posts which have already been answered especially when answered by one of the regulars who one knows always gives good advice.

I am nervous about this post as I don’t want to upset anyone. It’s a really nice forum only when one pops onto Screwfix forum does one realise how good this is. We mention Part P but don’t shove it down people throats. And when mistakes are made and I have made many the correction is polite. And of course every one gives up their free time to help others. I picked the example as I hope the person will realise it is only that an example of what does happen and there is no criticism on this particular one as the way the question was put does ask of that sort of reply.

Eric
ericmark

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